Season 1, Episode 6: “I Lent My Boyfriend Money. He Took It to a Casino.”

Theme Song 0:00
If you need some dough
You don’t know where to go
In this patriarchal capitalist hellscape
 
Well here’s the ‘sitch
We’re gonna help you, sis
Because bitches get riches
 
Bitches get riches
Bitches get riches
Bitches get riches
And so can you

Kitty  0:31
You have a very special energy.

Piggy  0:33
Wait me? Are you talking about me?

Kitty  0:35
Yes, you yeah talking about you. You have this energy where you’re very game like almost like when someone is dancing you’re very good at following their lead. It’s because you’re like a very present person and you are a very like positive person. But any gross old man who is looking for signs of interest from a hot young woman is going to see that gameness and go, ha, here it is. You don’t want to tell someone like, all right, we’ll stop being game and friendly all the time. Like, no, that’s who you are. That’s what you should be. People should just stop fucking taking advantage of it.

Piggy  1:18
I know you said this the other day and like you’ve been doing this our entire friendship, which I really appreciate, is that you’re really good at protecting me. I don’t wanna say like protecting me from myself, but like, making sure people give me the space I need because I do – I am a friendly person. And I do want to be welcoming to people and like, you know, you and my husband have both said this, which is that my tendency is to see the best in people first. And like once they screw that up like that, it’s like you’re fucking done, you’re dead to me. But until that happens, like I will afford you every chance to just you know, prove yourself a good person. It’s just like when I’m tired and I’m cranky, which I am after this, you know, week long work conference that I just get so tired of putting on this performance and being forgiving of people for not being understanding of my personal boundaries? Does that make sense?

Kitty  2:09
Oh, absolutely. It’s infuriating that this is a problem – constantly having the way that they are misinterpreted as “I would LOVE to fuck you 60 year old man”

Piggy  2:24
Who is my father’s age…

Kitty  2:26
…Who is my work with – like gross – like where are you getting these? Penises are the ultimate optimists, but they really

Piggy  2:34
It’s true!

Kitty  2:35
They’re sending them signals straight up just going hey, I think – no, I’m certain…

Piggy  2:42
They have no interest in mitigating my stress…

Kitty  2:45
Adding to it!

Piggy  2:45
…and every interest in making me uncomfortable for their own – and adding to it! They add to my stress because they know that it makes them feel good when I squirm and when I sort of have to put up with them, putting their fucking arms around me and leaning in.

Kitty  3:03
I think I just thought of a fantastic rule of thumb. So, I’m sure at some point you’ve heard the advice of like, never assume that a woman you’re talking to is pregnant. Don’t ever say, “oh, like when are you due?” Like don’t say anything, basically until you see a baby coming out – until you see crowning do not assume that a woman is pregnant because at some point, you’re going to open your mouth and say something to a woman who just happens to have a roundish belly or had a burrito a couple hours ago and you are going to feel like such a shithead. I think the same should go for don’t assume a woman wants to fuck you unless she like, takes off her clothes, spreads her legs, spread to her Virginia and says “I want to feel you deep inside of me” like go ahead and assume – you know what i’m probably, if my penis is telling me “Hey I bet she, I bet she wants this here on or in her” like just go ahead and say “Penis – no. We’re not doing that.” Until I have like a written invitation in like embossed Times New Roman saying I am sexually attracted to you and open to acting on it – if you are check yes or no like until you get that letter delivered by a butler wearing white gloves, just go ahead and assume she does not want to fuck you.

Piggy  4:28
Yeah, I actually want to say for the record that I send out my sex invitations written in calligraphy and sent out via Pony Express.

Kitty  4:37
My sex-vitations are written in Papyrus.

Piggy  4:40
My favorite font! And that’s like a deep cut, like a deep cut to your library.

Kitty  4:46
It really is. Oh my God, I hate Papyrus.

Piggy  4:48
If they don’t get the irony, they’re not worthy.

Hey, so I’m Piggy.

Kitty  5:01
I’m Kitty!

Piggy  5:02
And we are the bitches of Bitches Get Riches.

Kitty  5:05
We are the Lifetime Original Movie lesbian best friends that you so richly deserved.

Piggy  5:11
And we’re here to try to warn you about him guuurl!

Kitty  5:14
Our time on this planet is limited.

Piggy  5:16
So let’s get started.

Kitty  5:18
Today’s letter comes to us from Reddit. I’ve been creeping on Reddit again. My, 21 year old woman, boyfriend, 28 year old man, owes me over $100 and I found out he went gambling last night.

J’accuse!

Or for nerds a real Phoenix Wright “objection!”

Piggy  5:40
Objection!

Kitty  5:43
My boyfriend never really has money and still lives with his parents. I recently paid for a $40 dinner, spent over $50 on groceries for him this month, and gave him $80 for food and weed. He says he will pay me back next paycheck and usually he does, but he’s always asking for cash. We are very honest with each other and we see each other almost every day. He said he’s flat broke, and I even paid off a loan for him. But I found out from a mutual friend that he went to a casino last night. Now I have no problem with him going out, and he has every right to go out and have fun, but he lives hours away from the casino, and I am a college student with very little money and have a hard time paying my bills with the money I keep lending him and he goes off to a casino, which is a very expensive place. Whenever he goes out he’s broke and he always says that his friends are buying, but I don’t know which friends he’s talking about. He tells me everything too so it’s very unusual for him to go on a day trip and not invite me or tell me about it since we go everywhere together and we always communicate. We’ve been together for three years and have a strong relationship and I spend the night at his house like four days a week even though he lives nearly 30 miles away. He’s not a moocher. I don’t buy him everything and we will usually go 50/50 on things. Should I confront him about why he’s not paying me back and going to an expensive trip that’s three plus hours away from his town?

Yeah, can we just take a quick pop away from the microphone for just one sec and really just let that out?

Piggy  7:06
Ughghg

Me too. Okay. Here it goes…AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

Kitty  7:21
OH MY GODDDDD!!!

Piggy  7:21
All right, that feels better.

Kitty  7:23
I needed that. Thank you.

Piggy  7:25
Who boy! Also my dog was snoring through your reading of the question and when I – when I just full on screamed he gave me the most accusatory look.

Kitty  7:35
Another j’accuse.

Piggy  7:36
J’accuse!

Kitty  7:39
The theme of this episode is accusation! Like when they’re right and when they’re really right, which they are really wrong.

Piggy  7:45
They’re never wrong.

Kitty  7:47
This is terrible.

Piggy  7:49
Oh, man. I just I feel so bad for her because it sounds like they’re – they both do not have money to be spending on nights out at the casino, like come on, man. Ahhh!

Kitty  8:01
There are some really basic things that I’m going to point out here that really stand out to me. So she is 21 and he is 28. I have very strong feelings about a big age gap, especially around this age.

Piggy  8:16
Yes.

Kitty  8:17
I think that there are folks who are in their 40s who can date someone in their 60s, there are people who are in their 30s who could date someone in their 50s or 40s. And everything sort of netted out so that they are at the same point in their lives, but – so they’ve been helped me out with some math here. This can be a challenge. So they’ve been together for three years, meaning she was 18.

Piggy  8:44
AHHHH!!! She was 18 and he was 25. I already don’t like that.

Kitty  8:49
That would be a high school senior dating someone who is like already post-college for a few years.

Piggy  8:58
There in the line and that is it.

Kitty  9:00
That’s a really big jump in how much your maturity level is.

Piggy  9:06
Yeah!

Kitty  9:07
I’m really nervous about a man or woman or non binary person who is dating someone significantly younger than them. It kind of tells me that their own age group is not interested in that.

Piggy  9:23
Yeah – is not putting up with their bullshit.

Kitty  9:25
And so they look for someone younger, who maybe doesn’t know as well and god bless this sweet child. How many times does she say we communicate great, we’re very honest with each other, he always tells me everything, we’re like – we always communicate.

Piggy  9:42
She’s really seeing the best in him, which I relate to.

Kitty  9:48
That is 100% her bringing that to the relationship and thus assuming that he must be bringing it too. And even when she’s confronted with pretty direct evidence that he is not being communicative with her, perhaps not being honest or forthright with her, she sees that and she goes, “Well, there must be something wrong with my misinterpretation, because the facts that I have or that we always communicate, and yet, I didn’t know about this.” And she doesn’t come out and say it, but she seems to be saying, “I’m pretty sure he went and spent money”. And there was a little bit that I cut out actually where she just for, to make it a little bit more bite size, but she actually specifically said that his friends -she was like, he’s got like three, and two of them moved away and one of them he’s on bad terms with them right now. And I’m like, hm. So his friends aren’t – he doesn’t have a lot of friends. His friends are not sticking around in the area to continue to hang out with him and he’s on bad terms with them. So good…

Piggy  11:03
Okay – you in danger girl.

Kitty  11:07
Girl you in danger!

Piggy  11:08
You in danger girl! So there’s a lot here so we’re just gonna go point by point, but one of the points I do want to bring up: you recently wrote an article on our award winning personal finance blog BitchesGetRiches.com – that little rag – that was about financial abuse. I do not necessarily think that this rises to the level of financial abuse but I do think it’s something that the letter writer and people in her situation need to be aware of because the fact of the matter is – there’s a significant age difference. He is an adult with the ability to work and make money, yet he is borrowing money from his girlfriend who says she’s going to college right now

Kitty  11:45
She is in college.

Piggy  11:57
Is in college and…

Kitty  11:59
And thus like can’t realistically be working.

Piggy  12:02
Exactly. So her earning potential is significantly lower, yet he’s borrowing money for from her

Kitty  12:07
Seemingly without much guilt.

Piggy  12:09
Yeah seemingly without much guilt – like that smacks to me as the precursors of some of the signs of financial abuse. And financial abuse is often the precursor to physical and emotional abuse. So, if you find yourself in a situation like this one where your partner is taking advantage of you financially, please watch out like, you know, be aware of the signs and be willing to admit that there might be a larger problem either already in the works or looming ahead of you. I also want to say like, just as a general rule of thumb, if you’re going to be borrowing money from somebody, you don’t get to have frivolous nights off until you pay that back, especially if that person is going to be struggling to pay the bills until you pay them back.

Kitty  12:58
We are so like, not usually the people who are going to say deny yourself every, every tiny luxury and every indulgence that makes life worth living until you’re debt free. Like that’s not at all our perspective usually, but if you have borrowed money from an individual, especially an individual whom you should probably love, like a, like a family member or a significant other, and that person is struggling to pay their bills, FUCK YOU going to a casino!

Piggy  13:30
FUCK YOU!! Yes, I want to use an example of like healthy borrowing from my own life. I am a rich bitch, as we all know by which I mean I have enough money to pay my bills, and plenty extra to put away in retirement funds and investments and savings, but my friend, she recently lost her job and her girlfriend and her car and so like things are rough for her right now. But she gets paid in cash, but her landlord only accepts the rent via Venmo. So, a couple times recently, she said, “Okay, I just got paid in cash, my landlord needs rent, like in a minute and I don’t have time to take the two hour bus ride to the bank to deposit this cash and then it’ll you know, take a while before it clears bank. Can you please Venmo me $60 and I’ll just give you the cash or I’ll then Venmo you back when I can put it in the bank?” And like, yes, of course, like anytime she needs that, like I have enough of a buffer where I can do that. But I know that she takes that loan  very seriously and she respects me, she respects my money and she respects what I’ve got going on. That is not the case with our letter writer. It’s not, you know, oh, I need about $100 and I’ll pay you back as soon as I can. It’s I need about $100 and I have no intention of paying that back in a timely fashion. Probably not at all. In fact, I’m going to go to a casino where people get rid of money! Casinos is where your money goes to die!

Kitty  15:05
Yes. Oh we it’s I think it’s not even worth dwelling on the fact that like don’t ever gamble like…

Piggy  15:11
Yeah – don’t fucking gamble!

Kitty  15:13
Casinos would not be in business if people regularly, routinely could like beat the house.

Piggy  15:20
The house always wins and they comp rooms to people who gamble more because they are making more than the cost of the room off of that person because they’re losing money.

Kitty  15:29
Casinos are designed to trick you, to warp your sense of the passage of time and how much money is really worth. Like there’s a reason you don’t you don’t like cash on the table and you do it on chips – it starts just feel like it means stakes, it doesn’t mean real money. Like everything they do is intentional, including as you said like giving out free rooms, free drinks, free food if your table’s hot. So yeah, we’re not fans of gambling.

Piggy  15:55
It’s just not a good thing.

Kitty  15:56
I think one of the things that upsets me the most reading this, I think this girl at this point, could walk away from this relationship and even though her boyfriend has spent a lot of her money and still actively owes her money, I think she could get out of the relationship and consider it a fairly cheap price for life lessons learned, I think. So I went through and I highlighted this and every negative thing that she said about him or his behavior, I highlighted blue and all the positive stuff I highlighted yellow. So I’m going to read you back how she describes him in positive terms.

Piggy  16:41
Do it.

Kitty  16:44
My boyfriend says he will pay me back by the next paycheck and he usually does. We’re very honest with each other. He tells me everything. We go everywhere together. We always communicate. We have a strong relationship. He’s not a moocher. We usually Go 50/50 on things.

Piggy  17:02
Okay, all right, that all sounds good.

Kitty  17:04
Yeah, it’s not like the, you know, earth shattering, but like fine. Here are the negative thing she had to say. He’s never really had money. He lives with his parents. He had her pay for a $40 dinner, $50 on groceries, and $80 for food and weed. He’s always asking for cash. He’s flat broke. She paid off loans for him, and then found out from a mutual friend that he went to a casino and didn’t tell her about it. He lives hours away from the casino, and still continued to borrow money from her even though he knows that paying her bills is really difficult. She doesn’t trust him when he says that, that a friend is paying. And she spends the night at his house like four days a week, even though he lives nearly 30 miles away.

So I think this is a really good example of how we can be very misaligned from the story that we tell ourselves, the story that we want to be true about ourselves and about our relationships versus what’s actually happening here. And when she says he tells me everything, we go everywhere together, we always communicate, we’re very honest with each other.

Piggy  17:51
Oh my god.

And then she says he lied.

Kitty  18:21
She doesn’t seem to understand. Yeah, that like, even within the same sentence, she’ll say, but he takes my time from me. He takes my money from me.

Piggy  18:33
He goes somewhere without me, without telling me.

Kitty  18:36
Exactly. And that’s, I think, a painful lesson that is best learned absolutely as soon as possible while the stakes are still low. Like thank god, she does not have a child with this man. Thank god, she’s not married to him. If someone that you’re dating, like I really don’t think that there’s a level of good enough that your significant other could be to justify them taking advantage of you in this systemic way. You’re always the one who’s going to his house even though it’s far away. You’re always the one giving your time even though you’re a college student, and he lives at home, you’re driving 30 miles to go – What?

Piggy  19:18
To his parent’s house?

Kitty  19:19
To hang out with him in his parents’ basement?

Piggy  19:20
Yuck!

Kitty  19:21
Girl no no!

Piggy  19:24
Like, okay, again, like, I know I just made a really strong noise of disgust, but there is nothing wrong with living with your parents as a renter if you need to at that age, like, but it should be a transitionary period and you should be figuring that shit out and you should not be requiring your barely legal girlfriend to drive all that way…

Kitty  19:46
To take you on a $40 dinner – no.

Piggy  19:49
The point is, he’s a 28…He is an adult, she is barely an adult.

Kitty  19:54
You are a fledgling.

Piggy  19:55
A fledgling. There is a power differential here and that is what the problem really is. And instead of using his power as a more experienced adult to either take care of this partner or you know show her the ropes of adulthood, or you know at the very least, you know, not had an extra burden on her while she’s a student, financially, timewise, driving wise. Instead he’s using his power to take advantage of her and that’s really – at the very least you can say it’s really not fair at the worst you can say it’s unethical.

Kitty  20:33
I really want this girl to know that like, this is not normal. This is not – it’s funny at the top before we were recording, we were talking about how you Piggy you have this very beautiful, innate trait where you really see the best in people and I see the same in this letter writer…

She is with someone who not being honest with her, but she says, Oh, no, he’s very honest. And she’s with someone who doesn’t tell her everything and she says, Well, he tells me everything. And I think it’s a great illustration of how even when you have this beautiful trait that you want to nourish, you also have to kind of recognize that this is a tendency that you have, and that it will leave you open to being taken advantage of. And that’s why I think in a situation like this, writing in for advice on in this case, Reddit, can be really helpful because when you really sit down and look at it with fresh eyes, and maybe try this thing we’re like, highlight the negatives, and then highlight the positives and then see like, are those positives really real? Are those negatives really real? That might be a helpful exercise, but like girl, get away from this guy. Like be was someone who’s in your own age group, be was someone who, if they have to rely on you, at least has like a healthy amount of like self awareness and I don’t know like a little bit of shame is good in these situation.

Piggy  20:56
Oh thank you.

Shame, respect for you and your situation, gratitude. No, I was talking about my friend who occasionally needs an advance on her rent. Like, she is deeply respectful of my situation and you know, she can’t pay me back in money, but she cleans my house for free sometimes. Like that is I understand to be like a really emotionally equal thing, you know, and I’m just I’m, I don’t know what our letter writers getting out of this fucking relationship. Maybe it’s great in the sack, I don’t know, but considering he fucking lives with his parents that seems unlikely.

Kitty  22:47
I cannot have a good orgasm in the same – under the same roof as my in-laws. I’m sorry in-laws. You’re really chill and really cool and I love your new kittens, but still there’s a bare minimum of hanky panky going on there because it’s just…No, no, no, no.

Piggy  23:06
And I know that we’re going to get some blowback about people saying like, “Oh, you can have an age difference between partners.” And I think that’s true to an extent, but I mean, there’s a difference between, let’s say, a 28 year old and a 35 year old being together, and an 18 year old and a 25 year old being together. You know, you both need to be like adults with experience adulting before that power differential is cancelled out, you know?

Kitty  23:35
Yes. There’s a really good – Dan Savage has a great piece of advice called the campsite rule and it’s that when you are dating someone who is significantly younger than you, you have an obligation much like when you are camping, in a lovely pristine wilderness site to leave your campsite cleaner than you found it. The idea that if you are going to date someone who’s significantly younger than you, you have more power, you have more money, you have a greater knowledge of yourself and your own needs and wants. And what you have in return is an obligation to not leave that younger person with warped expectations, emotional scars, bills and any kind of negative impact that ultimately makes them a less prepared, less self assured adult then you found them.

Piggy  24:37
I think that’s a great rule of thumb and I think it’s one that this 28 year old boyfriend is not following. And I like I know that the last couple times we’ve gotten questions about money and relationships we’ve just been like “Girl leave his ass!” But I truly think in this case, like she needs to just admit that that hundred dollars he owes her or however much it is, like that money is lost and she needs to save future money by no longer driving 30 miles each way to visit him and no longer you know, floating him this money for, like food I can understand, but the fact that she loaned him $80 for food AND weed?!

Kitty  25:19
That – girl.

Piggy  25:20
No no no no. Boy you are 28 years old by your own goddamn weed FULL STOP. If you’re 28 years old you can buy your own goddamn weed!

Kitty  25:28
This is not like – he’s not a chemo patient with like some medical marijuana that he desperately can’t afford – No.

Piggy  25:36
Food and weed says to me that he like wanted like a family size bag of Doritos and some like gutter weed like no. Fucking no! Listen, I am a 32 year old woman. I make my money honestly and I buy my own goddamn weed. And that is the sweetest high I have ever known.

Kitty  25:58
A-fucking-men.

Piggy  26:00
Are you good with that?

Kitty  26:02
I am so good with that. Honestly, well no I feel like we could have trashed him even more but like…

Piggy  26:07
No let’s keep going…

Kitty  26:08
We’ll have some restraint.

Piggy  26:10
Yeah, have a little restraint – no. So if you must stay with him, like if he is just like the greatest lay this side of the Mississippi River like fucking fine, but like, you need to equalize this relationship somehow and it involves him paying for his own weed and paying you back in a timely fashion instead of going gambling and having fun when you are hard up for the bills. So.

Kitty  26:33
Yeah, and if you need a recommendation on fantastic vibrators like if that’s what’s holding you back by all means, please reach out to me: Kitty@BitchesGetRiches.com and I will provide.

Piggy  26:44
That hey, that is a future article idea right there.

Kitty  26:47
Hey, you say that like I don’t already have a draft.

Piggy  26:50
Great. Okay, good. Just want to make sure on the same page. All right. Now, are you good with that?

Kitty  26:54
I am good with that.

Piggy  26:56
Listeners, if there’s a question you would like for us to answer: Go to BitchesGetRiches.com and click Ask The Bitches.

Kitty  27:01
There’s only one way to guarantee that will answer your question and that’s to become a Patreon donor.

Piggy  27:05
If you like what we do and you want us to keep going, please become a Patreon donor and support us with whatever donation amount you are comfortable with.

Kitty  27:13
We also have a merch store where you can buy t-shirts and printable worksheets and more.

Piggy  27:17
Finally, there are some free ways you can say thanks that doesn’t involve us running away with your money to gamble it.

Kitty  27:24
What a good idea. Oh my gosh, let’s do it.

Piggy  27:26
Now cut this out. cut this out, edit edit. Please rate and review us on iTunes, Spotify, Google Play whatever you use to listen, it bumps us up in the charts and makes us easier to find. You can also follow us on Twitter, Tumblr, Instagram and Pinterest. And if you subscribe to our articles, you will never miss a new one. You can do all of that at BitchesGetRiches.com.

Kitty  27:47
Hey, is there anything else that they should know?

Piggy  27:50
“Walk without rhythm and you won’t attract the world.”

Kitty  27:53
Good to know!

Kitty & Piggy  27:55
Bitches out!

Piggy  27:59
That was a fun one.

Huge thanks to Purple at A Purple Life for her help creating these transcripts!